What I am working on

  • Still working on re-mapping the site, which is tedious and boring.
  • Have RL stuff keeping me busy.
  • Had some really good discussions over at fMh recently, see the first comment below for links to them if you want to read up on them.
  • Working on a post on Hell, but this is a big topic for a lot of people so I want to get it just right. And right now it’s still missing something.
Hopefully I’ll have something substantial up soon.

Comments

What I am working on — 21 Comments

  2. Really? Having sex in garments? I guess Adam and I are evil, because we sure don’t!
  3. One of the sex prep books Paul and I read when we were engaged was Between Husband & Wife by LDS authors Stephen E. Lamb and Douglas E. Brinley. IIRC, there was a very vague sentence on sex and garments which basically said, act in accordance with your conscience and the Spirit.
    My eyes got really wide and I thought, are they actually implying that there are people who think garments ought to stay on for sex? Shouldn’t they be saying, “You don’t have to wear your garments for sex, guys.”
    Don’t get me wrong, people can dress however they want for sex and it’s none of my business whether it’s garments or a Catholic schoolgirl uniform. But keeping them on for sex because you feel like they should stay on at all times just seems so WRONG.
  4. I loved your guest post over on fMh (I’m that1girl) and would love to know if I can take you to LDS church with me on Sundays. I’d love to speak as clearly and eloquently as you do when throwing the BS flag. Unfortunately, I live in Tucson… Is there a snopes for LDS urban legends?
  6. IIRC, there was a very vague sentence on sex and garments which basically said, act in accordance with your conscience and the Spirit.
    My conscience says, “Get naked or get nothin’.”
    I’m trying to imagine the alternative.
    Hmmmm.
    Well, that was the least-provocative sex thought I’ve ever had. Maybe that’s what Mark E. Peterson should have suggested in his infamous talk.
  7. You’re going to have to link to that talk, now, Katie. I remember Elder Peterson from his very short books on Old Testament prophets, not from an infamous sex talk. :-)
    Anyway, y’know… it *is* a two piece ensemble… sometimes people might be in a hurry?
    This sort of conversation can only serve to scandalize my teenage daughters, you know.
  8. I’m linking it Rob, but it’s posted at an anti-Mormon site. EDIT & WARNING: Apparently there are adult advertisements at this site. I didn’t even notice, honest.
    My favorite part is when he recommends that you tie your hand to the bed post to prevent half-asleep masturbation.
    There’s also an Ebonics version which I think improves greatly on the original.
    And hey, Gs don’t always have to be 2-piece, though 2-piece is all my husband owns.
  9. Ebonics version = LOL. I like when they called it masturbashin’. You might want to warn readers that there are some ads for adult items on the page to which you linked, though. I made several purchases clicked away immediately out of intense shame.
    You know what I just thought of, Jack? ‘Member that story you told me about those kids at the fertility clinic who were, uh, “missing their target?”
    I’d bet you $50 they were doing it in Gs.
  11. Alright guys, here’s the story, but don’t read it if you can’t stand a humorous anecdote about sex.
    ——————————
    This was told to me by a friend who worked at a fertility clinic in Provo or Orem. You’re going to think it’s some kind of twisted urban legend, but she says she knows the couple in question because she worked at the clinic where they were being treated and she swears it’s true.
    A young couple who had been married for about six months began coming into the clinic to be treated because they had wanted to have children right away and they seemed to be having a hard time getting pregnant. The clinic began running every test they could on the couple. They taught the wife how to track her ovulation and put them on a sex schedule to maximize their chances of conceiving.
    After a few more months, the couple was still not conceiving and every test they ran showed that both the man and the woman were perfectly fertile. They were getting very frustrated and their marriage was starting to suffer for it.
    One of the doctors finally decided to go to the basic building blocks and ask them what exactly they were doing during sex. Then, finally, they discovered the problem.
    He was trying to go in through her belly button.
    The doctor… um… corrected them… and they were able to conceive not long after that. The end.
    ——————————–
    And yeah Katie, I’d bet money they were having sex in Gs, too.
  12. Ah yes… the belly button canard. Old when I was young, young’uns. Old when I was young… Kind of like the Heritage Halls tennis racket racket.
    I don’t think Mark Peterson wrote that stuff. It looks like a potpourri of every idea ever offered to break a habit, and doesn’t cite scripture anywhere, which is a big indicator that an Apostle didn’t write it and the Church didn’t send it out. Even “To Young Men Only”, filled as it is with advice we now know is not the best, had one or two scriptures.
    The real kicker, of course, is that since I was a teen in the early 80′s, I would have been shown this document. YM leaders in my ward, my own dad included, threw everything they could from the Church at the teen boys.
    Offer a citation away from anti-mormonism, and without ads for fleshlights, and I might be a little more convinced.
  13. See, I thought the belly button story sounded like an urban legend, but my friend from the clinic swore it was true. Maybe life imitating fiction?
    The tennis rackets thing was definitely a myth.
    On the Petersen talk, ReligiousTolerance.org says:
    The late Mark E. Petersen was a member of the Council of the 12 Apostles of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints – the Mormons. He allegedly wrote an article circa 1970 CE titled “Steps in Overcoming Masturbation.” 1,2 The essay is widely published by a number of anti-Mormon web sites, and allegedly has been distributed to students at Brigham Young University. We have asked the LDS repeatedly to check the authenticity of this document and to confirm that it is not a hoax. 3 We have never received a response.
    If it were a hoax, I imagine FAIR would have debunked it by now, but I see no reference to it at FAIR.
  15. For individual threads? Hmm, I will check how to do it and use a plug-in if I have to.
    There’s a “Comments RSS” link in the sidebar under “META,” but I think that’s for comments for the entire blog.
  16. Absence of evidence as evidence of absence, in the face of an assumption that silence implies an embrace, for a document that can only be found on the most stupid of anti-Mormon web sites?
    Sorry, Jack. Weak sauce; exmormon.org has a refutation of the silence:http://www.exmormon.org/mormon/mormon036.htm
    “In May 1995 article about masturbation, national magazine “Details” publishes seventeen of the recommendations and identifies Apostle Mark E. Petersen as author of “Steps in Overcoming Masturbations: A Guide to Self-Control.” In 1996, spokesman at LDS headquarters denies that Elder Petersen authored this document and denies that it was ever distributed.”
    Equally weak sauce, but it’s something; lds.org is completely silent on the matter.
  17. Rob, in Latin there’s a saying, “Qui tacet consentit.” Silence means consent.
    It may be lame that it’s mostly anti-Mormons posting the article, but that’s kind of what I would expect if it were genuine, especially if it’d been originally intended for a very small audience and then leaked: anti-Mormons trying to circulate it while the church remains silent on it. I remember coming across this thing back in 1998, so it’s been making the rounds for a long time.
    I’ve also always known ReligiousTolerance.org to be very fair. If they say they can’t get an answer from Church HQ on the issue, they aren’t lying.
    Given that it matches the other rather prudish trends from church leaders of the era—BKP’s talks on sex and masturbation, Spencer W. Kimball & the First Presidency attempting to ban oral sex—I’m inclined to believe that it’s genuine.
    BTW, it’s reproduced in part (and somewhat paraphrased) without attribution at the pro-Mormon site Light Planet as genuine advice to young men struggling with masturbation. Apparently they didn’t think it was a hoax.
  18. And I should clarify something: I totally don’t care that BKP or Mark Petersen or Spencer W. Kimball had prudish ideas about sex or masturbation or oral sex or anything else. Some of them were born in the 19th century (!). Of course their ideas on how to handle sexual issues were dated and rather stiff, no pun intended. Who cares?
    I read these talks, I chuckle, I go on with my day. I’m sure I’d feel the same way if someone slipped me Protestant talks on sex by men who were born in the late 1800s or 1920s or whatever.
  20. No, you’re conflating things here. Sayings in latin do not establish authorship; it’s an improper use of a civil legal principle which addresses property rights.
    Weak sauce, considering the claim from an equivalently reliable source that the Church has denied that the stuff comes from Peterson.
    I’m going with hoax, because it’s disorganized drivel, not because it contains stupid advice from the three-million-member era.
    Say whatever else you will about people called into the Quorum/Council of Twelve Apostles, they aren’t as slack-minded as that document is. Thus, no supportable claim to authorship, both because of a second-hand but sympathetic denial of authorship, and because of style problems. Even casually, wouldn’t a textual critic agree?
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