My visit to Willow Creek North Shore

I know what you’re thinking. “Jack, YOU?! A mega-church?” And Willow Creek Community Church isn’t just any mega-church, it’s the fourth-largest mega-church in the country with some 23,000 weekend attendees (for comparison, Mark Driscoll’s Mars Hill mega-church whichBrianJ and I visited back in April has 7,500 weekend attendees). It’s a non-denominational church which was founded in 1975 by Bill Hybels, who is still the current senior pastor.
As to what first attracted me to Willow Creek: the church was co-founded by Gilbert Bilezikian, one of the leading egalitarian scholars and author of Beyond Sex Roles: What the Bible Says About a Woman’s Place in Church and Family, and as far as the roles women perform, it is the land of Egalitaria. It has women serving as executive pastors, associate pastors, and teaching pastors. 3 of its 12 current elders are women and 14 of its 32 area pastors are women. They allow women to perform baptisms and serve communion, and a woman gives the message that the entire campus listens to about once every two months. 
Today I went and visited the North Shore campus in Northfield, Illinois, which is just under a 30-minute drive from my home. Here are the perks of my visit:
  • The campus was easy to find and they had nifty “first time visitor” parking spaces reserved, though there was plenty of parking available nearby.
  • I was greeted at the entrance wherein I announced that I was a first-time visitor and asked to see Wendy Olver, the area pastor I had spoken with on the phone, so the greeter spirited me off to see her and I chatted with her for a few minutes. They gave me cards which contained notes to follow along for the day’s sermon.
  • I headed into the service where worship was just starting. Pretty standard for an evangelical church: upbeat contemporary music, guitars, drums, and hand-clapping. The music was nowhere near as loud as the music in Driscoll’s church (thankfully).
  • I was somewhat surprised by the make-up of the congregation. I guess when I hear “mega-church” I usually think “lots of college-aged people,” but this congregation consisted of mostly middle-aged people, which is good. I’m a bit more interested in hanging out with them than the early 20s crowd.
  • I did not get the chance to check out the children’s program while I was there, but I had spoken at length on the phone with one of their children’s directors and it sounded like a pretty thorough program.
  • One of the programs I was given listed the church’s budget and annual givings to date, right there for everyone to see. We’ve had discussions over at LDS & Evangelical Conversations on openness in giving.
  • The sermon was delivered by Steve Gillon, the campus pastor. It was on spiritual gifts and I think it was probably the best sermon I’ve ever heard on the subject. (I’m going to type up and post my notes on it later.) Normally they tune into the main campus speaker for the Sunday message, but they said these past few weeks they’ve been trying something different. So with only about 400-500 in attendance and the speaker right there in front of me, my visit today wasn’t really much of a “mega-church” experience.
The church was also performing baptisms later today, but I could not attend since I had to return home to pick up Paul and Harley from the LDS church. They reported 92 people have signed up to get baptized today in addition to the 12 people they’ve baptized throughout the year—last year, they only baptized 56 people total. The video they showed of last year’s baptisms really stirred me. I thought the people getting baptized looked so joyful.
Given Kevin Barney’s warnings to me last week, I did search the class catalogue to see if they had any pending classes on Mormonism coming up, but found nothing. If the North Shore campus has dabbled in the counter-cult ministry, it’s not showing right now, and that’s good.
I enjoyed my visit today. I don’t know if Willow Creek North Shore is the best option for me, but it’s certainly an option.
Next week I’ll be visiting an esoteric cult known as The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints so I can preach in F&T meeting and introduce myself to my husband’s ward. I really, really love this thing where Mormons let anyone approach their pulpit and preach… suckers.
The week after that I’ll probably be visiting either The Edge Church or The Presbyterian Church of Palatine. We’ll see.

Comments

My visit to Willow Creek North Shore — 18 Comments

  1. So, after you do all this investigative leg-work, and study it out in your mind, are you going to pray about which church Heavenly Father would like you to attend?
    I admire all the leg-work you’re putting into it. When I looked for a church back in 1982, I just prayed about it first.
    Hey, should we “warn” these churches about you, and send them a link to your blog? Maybe give them a heads up that one of the “Assassin Wives of Fury” will be visiting.
  2. Now Jack, You know that F&T isn’t made for anyone to preach, but rather to share sincere and heartfelt testimonies of the Savior and what he’s done for you. Preach not.
  4. I’m glad you had a good experience there, Jack.
    At the mother ship, when you drop a child off to the nursery, you’re given a number. Then when you go into the auditorium, you sit towards the back, so you can see video screens of the action down on the stage. If they need you to come and deal with your child for any reason, they put your child’s number up on the screen. I was very impressed by that; it’s a brilliant system.
    And I’ve also attended a baptism, in the actual Willow Creek. Dozens and dozens and dozens of people; I have no idea how many. That service was well done as well.
    I actually like Willow Creek. But I just can’t see you going to a megachurch, Jack.
    Are you going to explain to Paul’s LDS congregation that you’ll be attending once a month but are not a subject for proselyting? Actually, I think it might be better coming from Paul. But one of you should make that clear publicly to the ward; that will improve your experience there markedly, I believe.
  5. Actually, I think it might be better coming from Paul.
    I agree. Of course, the fact you’re attending a Protestant seminary should help. :)
  6. I’ve never actually had much of a problem with wards getting overzealous in their conversion efforts. At worst maybe the missionaries will stop by once, and they easily back off when I point out that I have a degree from BYU. If they ask me why I haven’t joined the church, my answer this time is “Because I don’t want to join a church which tells me what kind of underwear I have to wear.” That is my answer and I’m sticking to it.
    I wanted both of us to meet with the bishop to discuss a few things:
    1) I’d like to try to delicately ask that he not urge Paul not to discuss with me what goes on inside the temple every time he has a meeting with him. The last bishop we had seemed overly concerned with this. Seriously, I don’t pester Paul to teach me the über-secrets of the temple. I know more than enough as it is.
    2) I’d like him to know that I will support Paul in any callings he wants to give him. He doesn’t have to hold back callings for fear of creating tension in our home or anything.
    3) I’d like to encourage him to get other families in the ward to invite Paul to attend the temple with them. He doesn’t go a lot because I don’t go, which most people I’m sure would understand, but it kind of makes me feel bad. (I have absolutely no knowledge of the etiquette on these things, so maybe I shouldn’t be saying that on my blog, but there you go.)
    As I was typing this, my husband came by and mentioned that the bishop has somehow gotten in touch with him and asked if he and the 1st counselor can come visit us sometime in the apartment. So there ya go.
    Bookslinger, I’ll get to your question tomorrow. It’s getting late for me.
  7. I’m glad you haven’t had much of a problem with overzealousness towards you. I know it *can* be a problem, so your experience is a good thing.
  8. Bookslinger ~ I have to confess, I’ve never been a huge fan of the LDS church’s proposed method of obtaining revelation from God. I’m fine with the idea of asking God directly what He wants for my life, but there seems to be this expectation in the LDS church that God will immediately answer (or will answer during the time you spend on your knees asking). I’m not trying to level the “feelings” accusation at Mormons, but God does not typically manifest a spiritual burning after I say prayers or anything like that. I spend some time in prayer, I go about my days and eventually, somehow, God answers. Often it comes when I’m on a walk or out in nature; I feel most at peace with God there. Rarely does it come when I’m in my bedroom on my knees. Sometimes it comes through a scripture that jumps out at me or the words of a fellow believer or even from secular shows and writings, or it comes when I’m journaling and thinking things out. I guess what I’m saying is, I communicate with God constantly, in many ways.
    Anyways, I have prayed about where to go to church and I am praying about where to go to church, and I pray before I visit these churches. I imagine that by the time I visit the last one, I’ll have a pretty firm idea of which one I want to go to. It probably won’t require a massive pray-out.
  9. there seems to be this expectation in the LDS church that God will immediately answer (or will answer during the time you spend on your knees asking).
    No such expectation has ever been taught to me. The normative teaching, is found in Galatians 3, and isn’t terribly different from the impressions and interpretations given by any charismatic Christian I’ve met.
    While there are certainly Mormons out there who expect D&C 9 to work like a vending machine, even for things not related to translations of scripture, the most naive picture drawn from that point of view contradicts the rest of scripture in general.
    As a missionary, I taught Galatians 3 combined with D&C 9 (using its context) and other scriptures. No promise of immediacy is explicitly given any place that I can recall. In fact, the implications from D&C 24 and 100 suggest strongly that revelations and impressions come on God’s timetable, or not at all.
    Mostly, though, in my case it’s family experience. My parents attested from time to time to revelations which amounted to “it doesn’t matter what you decide in this case.” D&C 58 and 124 both contain revelations similar to that.
    Maybe you don’t need a specific revelation to decide which church to attend, either because, to God, the choices on your list are too similar, and thus God has no preference one way or the other, or (my preferred interpretation) he knows your mind and heart and trusts you to make correct decisions using them.
  10. … but there seems to be this expectation in the LDS church that God will immediately answer (or will answer during the time you spend on your knees asking).
    No such expectation has ever been taught to me.
    Nor to me. My experience is much like what Jack describes, and is very seldom (if ever) dramatic. And often, the answer is what Rob suggests may often be the case: “You decide.”
  12. “Rarely does it come when I’m in my bedroom on my knees. Sometimes it comes through a scripture that jumps out at me or the words of a fellow believer or even from secular shows and writings, or it comes when I’m journaling and thinking things out.”
    Funny, that’s the way it happens to some of us LDS types. Rob is right; It’s not a “vending machine” response. And, “you decide” happens to a number of us.
    On a side note, my father once mentioned if an Archeologist dug up a vending machine in the distant future, he could think we worshiped them by giving a money offering, and it gave us what we selected!
  13. Jack: I think what you describe as to how you’re going about getting answers to prayer is pretty much in line with what the LDS church teaches. You’re studying it out in your mind, asking in prayer, and eventually (not necessarily immediately, but it could theoretically) receive an answer.
    I concur with both Rob and Eric; there’s also no _one_ way to receive answers, even in the LDS paradigm. The binary “burning in the bosom” (yea) versus “stupor of thought” (nay) is just one possibility. It can be while on one’s knees, or days/weeks/years later. Answers can arrive through any combination of several different vectors.
    I especially like Rob’s point about how the LDS teaching is also in line with the charistmatic (Pentecostal/Evangelical) gifts of prophecy and revelation. Evangelicals taught me about God answering prayers long before I investigated Mormonism. They’re the ones who first taught me prayer is a two way communication.
    You wrote: “I imagine that by the time I visit the last one, I’ll have a pretty firm idea of which one I want to go to.” [emphasis mine]
    Ok, I get that. Let me ask a hypothetical: What if the Lord directs you to a church that isn’t your first choice? What if you choose The Edge, but He tells you to attend the Presbyterian church? What’s your overall goal, to find one _you_ like, or find the one Heavenly Father wants you to go to (if there is one that He wants you to go to)? I guess I’m asking: are you open to that possibility?
    You know where I’m leading to, but it’s just a hypothetical, ok? :-)
    You have a very unique combination of viewpoints, knowledge sets, and talents. You’ll be a prized asset no matter where you attend church. I think I know the answers, so these are rhetorical questions. Are you attending a church for _your_ (and your daughter’s) benefit alone? Is your desire to serve only where you want to serve, or do you wish to labor in that part of the vineyard where the Lord thinks your talents are best suited for His purposes? (Assuming He does have a specific choice or preference for you among all those on your list.)
    Which church to attend can be a personal choice, but it can also be viewed as a calling for those times when the Lord does have a particular slot for us to fill.
  14. I’m grateful for those who’ve pointed out “God isn’t a vending machine.” I wrote here about some of the cultural Mormonism that says “God will give us whatever we want if we want it bad enough.”
  15. Long story short, Paul is one of those Mormons who tends to expect an answer from God right away. So if my understanding of how LDS expect answers to prayer is off, that’s why.
    Met with the bishop at our apartment tonight. I thought it went well. He’s a cool bishop. I did bring up all of the issues I mentioned above and he was cool with them.
  16. Jack, sounds like you’ve got a line of LDS folk ready to smack Paul for his Instamatic Revelation expectations. (Sorry, Paul!)
    I agree with all those who say that God makes us wait, or He just tells us to decide. And, of course, there is that great line in the Restoration DVD that is given by Joseph’s dad: “God answers our prayers. He does it in His own time and in His own way, but He does answer.” (Or something like that… it is late and I need to go to bed… picking up Adam and Meredith in St. Louis tomorrow – shall I tell them that you say hi?)
  18. I’m glad thing went well with the bishop. For those of us who don’t fit in the typical LDS cultural mold (which by definition includes the Meyers family, obviously, but also includes mine with its generally left-of-center politics and general nonrigidity on various things), life is better when the bishop doesn’t expect everyone to approach life in the same way that he does.
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