A brief note on my church hunt

I attended another church on Sunday as usual. The people there were perfectly sweet, inviting and wonderful, but it was the first church I’ve visited so far where I sensed pretty clearly from the visit that it really isn’t what I’m looking for. Therefore, I do not have a lot to write about and do not wish to do a post which makes it sound like I’m putting this church down. They did not do anything wrong, it just was not the right fit for me.
That said, I’ve begun to grow weary of this church hunt. I’m a little tired of e-mail correspondences with pastors on their gender policies. Everyone has been gracious, but hearing again and again the defenses for barring women from being elders has grown exhausting. Even worse are the churches which give evasive answers to my very specific questions and urge me to just come visit them myself. I mean, “how often do you invite women as guest speakers” isn’t really that hard of a question to answer, is it? I can’t shake the suspicion that the reason some churches avoid answering it is because they know the answer is, “Almost never.” Sorry, but it is important to me that I get to hear women preach on Sundays as well as men, even if only occasionally.
The other problem is that I’m really beginning to miss attending church with my husband and daughter. Apologies have been said by all parties concerning the incident that happened at Paul’s ward on the 6th, but no one has contacted us to set a time to meet and talk about it, so that’s still unresolved and I don’t really care to visit until it gets resolved. I don’t really want to drag Paul and Harley on these expeditions, as I’m much more free to assess the church and ask questions without them. The end result is that we haven’t gone to church together in over a month now, and neither of us likes that much.
I do have a few more churches I could check out—one in particular that I really want to check out—but I’m not sure if I have the heart to keep going. I miss having a church community that already knows me when I walk through the door on Sunday, miss the security and the warmth of being welcomed by people who can call me by name on sight. I’m torn between my desire to not be a hasty buyer and my sense that it’s time to stop flying and find a nest.
I’m prayerfully considering this question over the next few days. I’ll let you know by Sunday what I decide.

Comments

A brief note on my church hunt — 27 Comments

  1. Thanks David. I appreciate your advice. My decision is probably between DeerGrove and Church of the Redeemer at this point. I really like the female pastor at DeerGrove, but Redeemer has some awesome students and alumni attending whom I really like.
    One of the female professors on campus invited me to come to her church. That’s the one I want to check out, but she won’t be there this Sunday and I’m not sure I want to wait another two weeks to be done with this hunt.
    I’d have a lot more options for women pastors if I lived closer to Chicago, but north Chicago is a little further than I’d like to travel.
    I might as well say what it was about this last church that made me so sure it would not work for me. It was the music. Their music was pretty much the same as sacrament meeting: slow hymns played to a solo piano interspersed throughout the meeting. It probably sounds silly, but weekly worship is a pretty sacred experience to me and I don’t think I could do a church where I don’t connect with the mode of worship. Besides, “better music” (that’s what he calls it) is one of the few things my husband really loves about evangelical churches, so I’d like to maintain that.
  3. Jack,
    If you want my worthless opinion on the subject, it seems like the Deer Creek Covenant Church was the best fit for you. If women’s ordination is really important you might also try a more mainline Protestant Church such as ELCA or the Episcopal church (Anglican communion). If you are interested in a high liturgy, these would also be good bets.
    Of course, going the mainline route will most likely involve other compromises, and I don’t know if those are deal breakers for you.
  4. It was embedded in a longer post, and I feel a little guilty for blogging about it, but here’s the recap: Paul had told a member of the bishopric that I was planning to give my testimony at the F&T meeting this month. When I was walking into the sacrament hall on Sunday the 6th, one of the counselors stopped me and told me that non-members aren’t allowed to give testimonies at this stake. This hurt my feelings and I really didn’t care to be singled out like that, so I left.
    The bishop has apologized, the counselor has apologized, and I’ve apologized, too. The counselor did find the discussion on this blog about it, which made me feel really bad for immediately running out and bitching about it on teh Intarweb. I should have shown a little restraint and waited until I had talked to them about it.
    Anyways, looks like the bishop e-mailed Paul last night to set up an appointment on Sunday and talk about it, so hopefully we can discuss it then, but I don’t think I’ll blog about what we discuss.
    I probably will wind up going back to my husband’s church once a month one way or another. I think both the bishop and the counselor are deeply sorry about what happened, and if you want to get technical they do have the right to keep a non-member from approaching their pulpit—though the thought of it does make me a little heartsick. However, had they broken the policy to me a bit more tactfully I probably would not have had the reaction I did.
  5. Becoming a member of the LDS church has overall been a very positive experience for me. But I can understand what you’re saying. The thing I miss the most about my evangelical days is the music.
    I’m no fan of the “repeat the same simplistic line 20 times” style that is found in some evangelical churches, but with that exception, the larger evangelical churches really do have “better music” than we do.
    The last evangelical service I attended (with relatives) surprisingly had music that included two songs that are in the LDS hymnal (plus a few contemporary tunes). But putting them to a soft-rock beat (I think they used drums, electronic keyboard, electric guitar and brass of some sort) made such a difference that it actually seemed worshipful rather than strained.
    Sorry, my LDS friends, but the 19-century music style we just just doesn’t cut it for me. I wish it did.
  6. Aw Eric, the 19th century hymns are like warm white bread from Wal-Mart… nice and comfortable!
    Plus it’s not true anyway: A couple of those hymns are twentieth century hymns. It’s true! One or two of them were even written by Janice Kapp Perry, and I know she’s alive around Utah somewhere.
    Ahem.
    Hey Jack, why not just attend the church the Savior writes on your heart, egalitarian or not?
  7. Sorry, my LDS friends, but the 19-century music style we just just doesn’t cut it for me. I wish it did.
    Seriously. Just because the church was founded in the 19th century doesn’t mean we have to stay stuck there.
  8. Eric ~ Thanks. I thought you would understand, and I completely agree on those “repeat the same line a million times” songs. Of course, if you believe the LDS church is true I could understand saying good-bye to the music you love, but it’d be nice if you didn’t have to choose between one and the other.
    If I were LDS, I’d be out on my balcony with my guitar every Sunday night to make up for it.
    Rob ~ I’m pretty sure the Savior did write egalitarian on my heart. I know that one of the churches I’ve looked at so far can work for me, I just want to be sure I’m exploring all of my options.
  9. Of course, if you believe the LDS church is true I could understand saying good-bye to the music you love, but it’d be nice if you didn’t have to choose between one and the other.
    Well, truth does matter. I do on occasion listen to contemporary Christian music (some LDS, some not) on CDs and MP3s, just not during sacrament meeting, so it’s not like I had to give it up entirely.
  10. @Jack — Please don’t doubt that I think you’re a force for good in the world.
    I think that LDS music not exiting the 19th Century stems in part from the fact that the Mormon Tabernacle Choir has essentially raised that style of music to an exquisite art form.
    Another part of it has to do, I think, with what Mormon culture considers to be “worshipful”, which by and large doesn’t include a drum beat or a horn section, or very much guitar at all. The use of brass instruments in the Chapel is still strongly discouraged, even today, I recall. (Though a friend of mine is a trumpet player, and played his horn at an Easter musical presentation one year. Gorgeous stuff.)
    And the other big part is that all the attempts to produce commercial-contemporary music have come as, mainly, self-conversations, written and produced by Corridor Mormons for Corridor Mormons. It is ecclesiastical without being ecumenical or ministerial.
    And, frankly, too much of it just stinks.
    A lot of EV-Christian contemporary stuff stinks too, but because the population is sooo much larger, the rare good stuff is more frequent. Thus, I have a track from MercyMe and a whole Take6 album, but nothing from the Mormon Contemporary offerings.
  11. Jack, I thought I would help you find a church. So I googled:
    egalitarian evangelical church illinois
    And the second item was Clobberblog itself(!), and the other first page items were books and such.
  12. Jack,
    I am continually impressed at how important it is for you and Paul to attend church togetherdespite your differing beliefs. I wish you the best in getting settled in a new Church home. You’ll find the right place.
    I would love it if a non-LDS bore a testimony in our testimony meeting (as long as it wasn’t anti-LDS or condescending, etc. which I know you wouldn’t be). In fact, I’d love to hear what testimony you’d give over an LDS pulpit. Maybe sometime I’ll visit your ward on fast Sunday. :)
  14. Something that Kullevo and I did when we were searching for a post-LDS church was go on the hunt, like you’ve done, and then go for awhile to Cedar Ridge, where we now attend exclusively. But, before I said that that was where I wanted to stay (and Kullervo stopped being Christian), we would still occasionally try out other churches, just to see. That way, we were still recognized, and when we just wanted to go somewhere that wasn’t new, we had a church home, but didn’t commit to it being the permanent home until we (I) decided that that was what I wanted.
    Oh, and if you want to hear AWESOME non-LDS testimonies and the hilarious reactions of the ward, go to Harlem. When the Harlem ward had F&T meeting, people would come in off the streets and say all kinds of crazy stuff–for example, a woman once walked in, got up and sang in tongues, finished, and walked out the door. Half of the people in the room clapped, the other half looked uncomfortable, both at the singing and then at the clapping. I don’t know if it’s still the same out there, but I stand by my belief that it’s the best. ward. ever.
  21. I’m a fan of Christian music artist Michelle Tumes, especially her “Center of My Universe” CD.
    “Deep Love”, “Heaven’s Heart”, “Lovely” (Center of My Universe), “Immortal”, “Missing You”, “With the Angels”, “Chant”, “Christe Eleison”, are all great tracks on that album. You can buy it used through Amazon, or buy it by the track via MP3 download. That’s one of my favorite CDs to listen to while driving.
    I also like Iona’s “Beyond These Shores” CD. They’re a Celtic group with Christian themes.
  22. One of my companions had a Christian music sampler on our missions and we’d listen to it sometimes. My favorite was always “It Takes a Little Time” by Amy Grant because my companion always walked SO EFFING SLOW.
  23. Jars of Clay, Newsboys, Third Day, and Caedmon’s Call are old favorites. Jennifer Knapp will probably never return to the Christian music scene but I still love her stuff.
    Songs like this I pretty much never get tired of listening to.
  24. Katie: my first mission companion was the opposite: he insisted upon walking just a bit in front of me—we were still side-by-side, he was just an inch or two in front.
  25. So, after much prayer and thinking, this is what I’ve decided in respect to my church hunt:
    I’m going to visit a PCUSA in Libertyville with Perry Downs tomorrow. If you need to know why Perry Downs is awesome and this is exciting, look no further than the Facebook group “Perry Downs Made Me Who I Am Today.” (Please note that should you happen to join this Facebook group, you will qualify for the special P. Downs express line on your way in at the Pearly Gates.)
    The week after that, I might visit an emerging church with Miriam Charter from the Educational Ministries department. I’m still deciding.
    After that, I will enter phase two: deciding between the top two churches. If I were to pick the top two churches today, they would be DeerGrove Covenant Church and Church of the Redeemer.
    DeerGrove has almost everything I want. A rockin’ female senior pastor whom I could really learn from, a worship format that I love, services that invite and encourage member participation, and incredibly friendly people. It’s a place that won’t undervalue me as a seminary student where I can grow and be a valuable part of helping the church grow for the next two years.
    The downside is, I’m not sure how much I’ll like having Harley with me for the first 30-45 minutes of each service. Harley has some social/behavioral problems beyond what’s normal for a three year-old, and wrestling her during worship twice a month may really cut into my enjoyment of the service.
    Church of the Redeemer has gorgeous services where both men and women participate throughout. I really do love the liturgy and could see myself making the switch to high church practices. There are some awesome TEDS students and alumni who attend there whom I know I could learn so much from, and they’ve made it clear that they value the attendance and participation of seminary students. (Some churches virtually ignore us because we’re “only” there 2-4 years.)
    The downside is the denomination’s polity of not ordaining women to the priesthood. Can I ignore that and see the local church for what it essentially is—an egalitarian congregation with a male senior pastor and a female associate pastor? I think that I can. (As a sidenote, its sister denomination, Anglican Coalition in America, ordains women.)
    I realize where I’m going wrong with this church hunt though. How silly of me to think I should be making this decision alone. Paul is my companion and my best friend, and whatever our theological differences, the place where I attend church effects him and he deserves to have some say in the matter.
    I’ve decided: for the month of October, I will make some repeat visits to the top 2 churches and bring Paul along, introduce him to the pastors, and ask him what he thinks. This will also allow us to have Harley test the children’s programs at each church.
    After that we will make our decision together.
  26. It’s interesting that you say that about including Paul, because I was going to write something along those lines on the other thread about your letter to a certain pastor. In that post, you mention that Paul is no longer allowed to “grill” pastors over the phone, and I was going to say that since he will be attending church with you that he should be included in the hunt.
    Then I took a step back and realized that it is very different for him than for you. For him, there is no church hunt: you go where geography dictates, and in this case it could have meant you not attending with him at all (because of that whole other thing). But you were not involved in any way in his church hunt—there was no hunt. So for me to say that he should get to take part in your hunt…well, it didn’t seem quite right. It seemed more like you should do the major part of the hunting and bring in Paul toward the end: “I’ve narrowed it down between A and B and I want you to help me choose” sort of thing. But I didn’t write any of that because I assumed that’s what you were planning anyway.
    Wow, I think that was a useless comment. Oh well!
  27. I don’t want Paul to be the one to bring up the subject of Mormonism with potential pastors. Our situation can be rather alarming to some pastors and it’s better if a fellow evangelical eases them into it so that they can have time to decide how they want to approach us.
    Once pastors are aware that he’s Mormon and they’re still interested in having our family participate with their church, I think it’s only fair that he should be allowed to meet with them and ask them any questions he has, including how they feel about Mormons if he wishes.
    I tried to return that favor to Paul and let him break the news of my non-member-ness to his current ward, but he just kept not doing it. When Paul wasn’t around and the bishop was clearly perplexed about why I wasn’t attending regularly, I kind of had to say it.
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